Sturgeon vs Salmond

[sally maclennane]

I know this is probably of more interest to Scottish turtles but I suppose many of us will be familiar with the experience of someone (usually a man) that you admire turning out to be a bit of a dick. I'll be honest and say that I don't like AS, I think he's pompous and egotistical whereas I like NS, and I think she's been a good First Minister. I get that he wants to clear his name, but he's done that in court already and I think this just looks vindictive. I suspect that he's annoyed that she's turned out to be a more popular FM than he was and she was the junior partner, not quite how it was meant to turn out, in his view. She has spoken about how devastated she was to find that her mentor was alleged to have assaulted other women but she was very clear that he had to be investigated. He says he was treated unfairly.

Selfishly I worry about the impact on the prospects of independence, there are elections in Scotland this May and the SNP are on course to do well. This could affect that, although it might not.

Is he just being a dick? Or is he the wronged party here?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-55738179

[lazzbo]

He's repellent, I don't think she covered herself in glory when she said she forgot meetings, etc., but he's an absolute super villain.

There doesn't seem to be a credible alternative to the SNP so I think your elections will be fine and Scotland will undoubtedly vote for independence, whenever you next get the chance.

[sally maclennane]

Yeah, the opposition is woeful here, Scottish Labour are just a shambles, their leader has just resigned (they go through leaders at a rate of knots!) And the Tories are never going to amount to much, I suspect they'll do worse this time than the last due to Johnson's shit handling of the pandemic.

I agree that NS didn't handle the investigation well, and she is normally very competent. I just think he really doesn't care about independence, it seems more important to him that he takes her to task for not blindly supporting him.

[lazzbo]

I shouldn't criticise Scottish Labour, given The Corbyn Years here, but MAN, get it together!

Yes, Salmond seems to be a bit of the Scottish Trump, if you will. Both in terms of narcissism and inappropriate behaviour with women.

[Morganna]

It's one of those difficult situations when someone (Salmond) feels personally betrayed by a person they thought they could trust because of history. Yes, people should be professional and detach themselves from personal feelings, but life doesn't really work like that. I can understand his feeling hurt, whilst still thinking he is a sleazeball.

He was found innocent, and whether or not you or I feel that he got away with it, that is the situation. If we assume that he is innocent, or imagine someone we care about being wrongly accused of something and then finding that their colleagues have not only not stood by them, but possibly acted illegally to bring them down, we'd probably see it differently.

I don't know. It's so easy to think 'He is an arse and deserves no better', but if Sturgeon was telling the truth when she said she was shocked to hear of his behaviour, then her actions smack of naked ambition over loyalty to someone who had helped her to get where she is. If she wasn't surprised at the allegations, why didn't she speak out earlier? Again, was it self-interest over doing the right thing and standing in solidarity with the abused women?

None of the above excuses his behaviour, obviously, but I don't think that this is a simple case of Salmon bad, Sturgeon good.

[Shoe]

I'm not following it closely but I don't really like him and I do think Nicola has done well as leader overall.

[Heebie Jeebie]

I did like him, and thought he did amazing work getting us to where he did. After the 2014 referendum I was gutted when he had to step down. I thought it would be the end for the SNP. Six years on I am blown away by the job Nicola Sturgeon has done and I think he must feel like any of us would if we left a job that we did well and then our successor did it even better. I get that since he has been found innocent he wants to continue to clear his name but I really wish, having worked so hard to gain independence for Scotland, he would focus on the bigger picture given that we are at a crucial juncture. It's clearing his name more than it has been already vs the entire future of our nation.

[Ruby]

He's a greasy shit and I'm inclined to support Sturgeon over him even if it turns out she's been murdering babies in her spare time.

[sally maclennane]

He's a greasy shit and I'm inclined to support Sturgeon over him even if it turns out she's been murdering babies in her spare time.

She doesn't have time for that right now, what with the pandemic and making Johnson look like a twat

[viggy]

He's a greasy shit and I'm inclined to support Sturgeon over him even if it turns out she's been murdering babies in her spare time.

Exactly

My extremely uninformed gut feeling is that she lied about those meetings because she was dancing a line between trying to be loyal to the man who was her mentor/damage limitation/still trying to do the right thing, and he's now using it as a stick to beat her with because she should have been 100% loyal to HIM.

[Edith Bacon]

It's clearing his name more than it has been already vs the entire future of our nation.

He’s totally putting his ego above the nation. I reckon he’s powered by bitterness and spite because Nicola is proving to be so much better than he was.

[viggy]

Oh God, 100% - it seems like his quest for Independence was less for the good of Scotland and more about his own personal power.

[Heebie Jeebie]

Exactly

My extremely uninformed gut feeling is that she lied about those meetings because she was dancing a line between trying to be loyal to the man who was her mentor/damage limitation/still trying to do the right thing, and he's now using it as a stick to beat her with because she should have been 100% loyal to HIM.

I bet you're right.

[kiwi]

He's a greasy shit and I'm inclined to support Sturgeon over him even if it turns out she's been murdering babies in her spare time.

I don't think you've been quite clear enough about whose side you are on there Ruby.

[sally maclennane]

It's clearing his name more than it has been already vs the entire future of our nation.

He’s totally putting his ego above the nation. I reckon he’s powered by bitterness and spite because Nicola is proving to be so much better than he was.

This is exactly what I think!