New World Order - Politics 2021

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sally maclennane
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

Post by sally maclennane »

Do we think anything will come of this Greensill stuff? It's more evidence of their corruption but it never seems to make much of a difference. Maybe this is affecting Dishy Rishi more though?

I've said it before but I think Johnson would have to punch the Queen before it would affect his polling.
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Bat Macdui
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

Post by Bat Macdui »

I genuinely don't know at the moment. Partly because 1. I don't actually really understand what's happened and 2. Because I think at least part of it is Johnson putting the boot into Cameron, possibly because of something inconsequential that happened at Eton over a biscuit in 76 or similar.
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Ruby
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

Post by Ruby »

Bat Macdui wrote: Wed Apr 14, 2021 6:26 pm I genuinely don't know at the moment. Partly because 1. I don't actually really understand what's happened and 2. Because I think at least part of it is Johnson putting the boot into Cameron, possibly because of something inconsequential that happened at Eton over a biscuit in 76 or similar.
These are also my thoughts on the matter. I have not actually scraped the surface of it because I know it will make me angry but that no-one else will give a shit.

And, yes, people don't seem to care what the Tories do as the bar has been lowered so far.
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sally maclennane
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

Post by sally maclennane »

Bat Macdui wrote: Wed Apr 14, 2021 6:26 pm I genuinely don't know at the moment. Partly because 1. I don't actually really understand what's happened and 2. Because I think at least part of it is Johnson putting the boot into Cameron, possibly because of something inconsequential that happened at Eton over a biscuit in 76 or similar.
:mog:

It is probably true but if it inadvertently brings him (Johnson) down too, I'll take it!
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Ella77
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

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God, I hope so. It feels like nothing can.
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Pippedydeadeye
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

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He’ll go when he’s had enough, thank you jolly very much.
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Pootle
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

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I'm not sure it'll bring Johnson down unfortunately. I totally agree with Bats about it being part revenge and everywhere seems to be saying Cameron didn't actually break any rules, it's just that the rules are shit so probably the most that will happen is a rule change. It's all so utterly sleazy and grasping though and I hope labour can manage to push home the point linking it with all the contracts for mates during covid. I think more of the government look worried because this was absolutely their retirement plan :))
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Morganna
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

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I think that there is a lot more to this than appears on the surface. The timing is suspect, and knowing what we do about the infighting in the Tory party, the odds are high that someone is pulling strings to manipulate what is already an appalling situation. I didn't see it as Johnson wanting to bring Cameron down, though - my first thought was that Cameron (as he apparently hasn't broken any rules) might have been behind the leak to discredit Johnson, or (maybe more likely) that Gove has a hand in it all. More is likely to come out in all of this, despite the obvious ineffectiveness of the internal 'behind closed doors' enquiry.

If Kier doesn't make capital of this, he really has to stand down.
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

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Morganna wrote: Thu Apr 15, 2021 12:43 pm I think that there is a lot more to this than appears on the surface. The timing is suspect, and knowing what we do about the infighting in the Tory party, the odds are high that someone is pulling strings to manipulate what is already an appalling situation. I didn't see it as Johnson wanting to bring Cameron down, though - my first thought was that Cameron (as he apparently hasn't broken any rules) might have been behind the leak to discredit Johnson, or (maybe more likely) that Gove has a hand in it all. More is likely to come out in all of this, despite the obvious ineffectiveness of the internal 'behind closed doors' enquiry.

If Kier doesn't make capital of this, he really has to stand down.
I agree with all of this based on the little I have read. Johnson is teflon, it doesn't matter what emerges about him, no one seems to give a hoot.

I'm not sure what Keir can really do - he lost the vote in parliament yesterday. What the real kicker is for me anyway is the newspapers lack of outrage - whilst they have his back I think nothing will really affect him.
Lately the DoE death, blood clots and the usual Harry/Meghan outrate are dominating the front pages.
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sally maclennane
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

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I agree Red, the media just ignore it all. If that was a Labour or SNP leader, they'd be going mental, calling for heads to roll. He gets such an easy ride, its infuriating.
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sally maclennane
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

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And now it turns out that Johnson was texting James Dyson, promising that Dyson wouldn't have to pay more tax if he supplied ventilators for the NHS. One of his minions was just on Breakfast news there, brushing it off "pandemic, crisis, what else was a PM to do? Nothing to see here, move along" :ella: And not that we needed it confirmed but how much of an arsehole is Dyson?

BBC News - Boris Johnson told Sir James Dyson by text he would 'fix' tax issue
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-56819137
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smalex
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

Post by smalex »

Dyson is (obviously) a massive twat, and I'm sure shit like this is happening ALL the time.... but I don't think this particular example is going to capture the public imagination because of the nature of the situation.
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sally maclennane
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

Post by sally maclennane »

You're right, and to be honest, he's Teflon anyway, it seems like nothing would damage his standing with his supporters.
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

Post by Pippedydeadeye »

It really angered me this morning that Oliver Dowden was sat in front of a picture of the Queen and defending the Dyson thing by likening the pandemic to war time. But people will swallow it & that’s that.
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Morganna
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

Post by Morganna »

Profiteering was a capital offence in wartime.

I don’t know - maybe if a really popular celebrity/national treasure started speaking out it might have an impact? It’s risky (eg Gary Lineker) but someone with enough clout and little to lose might make people think? I’m not sure who could do it though.
smalex
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

Post by smalex »

I just don't think this particular example is particularly...useful? as an example of what we all know/believe is happening on a much wider scale. Most people who think the government is corrupt probably already see Dyson for the selfish, manipulative, profiteering twat he is and... they already think the government is corrupt, and people who don't see it remember last March for the utter chaos it was and will give the government/Dyson a by on this. No amount of Gary Linekar is going to change it. Even Tony Blair (I think, judging from a half thng I heard on the radio this morning) has said everyone should calm down about it, its how these things roll in the chaos of a breaking pandemic.
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

Post by Ella77 »

Morganna wrote: Wed Apr 21, 2021 10:51 am Profiteering was a capital offence in wartime.
Good point.
smalex
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

Post by smalex »

Dyson is really fucking repugnant. I absolutely loathe him.
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Pootle
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

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It's all getting interesting now! I don't think the Greensill (not Boris directly) or Dyson (ventilators in a pandemic) were enough to cause him real trouble but Cummings turning on him could do it. Financing redecorating the flat in a possibly illegal and certainly unethical way against warnings, trying to stop an enquiry as it might unearth Carrie's pal and cause him trouble and obviously Cummings is willing to share texts and let in all out in the May to an enquiry - that could all be really damaging. Labour have finally called for the financing of the redecorating to be properly investigated and Dominic Grieve, the old attorney general, has called Boris a 'vacuum of integrity'. The Daily Mail is also anti Boris which is surely his key market - his current and previous Directors of Comms were previously Daily Mail journalists which doesn't seem to be helping :)) (I also enjoy the way reports are always talking about how skint he is because he has 6 'confirmed' kids to support :lol:). If more of his own lot start to turn, it could be very difficult for him.
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Re: New World Order - Politics 2021

Post by Pippedydeadeye »

Cummings as the good guy is a twist I did not see coming.
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