The Mock Turtle

The whole story is really fucking sickening. Like Sky, not much gets to me nowadays but this really has. It took months of planning. She must have been so frightened. The pictures of the things he bought to assist him in the crime - I felt a real chill looking at them. I would have got in that car too. It would never have occurred to me not to trust the police. The people who drove past and didn't realise (understandably!) what was happening must be in bits, too.

How the case was pieced together is testament to the huge amount of work done by those investigating. It is incredible.

Her poor family. Her dad telling him to look at him - their statements were so raw and powerful.

I have run out of words.

Luna wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 9:34 pm Woman’s hour had a good if somewhat depressing section on this today. Apparently, crap cops can get a transfer without question. This is what they do when they are close to being found out.

I heard this. It was indeed depressing.

Not all men is not an answer. We’re just supposed to have a second sight and know the good from the dodgy are we?

Just like the dodgy Catholic priests, no…?

Livilla wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 8:50 pm Christ the “Rapist” nickname - Met, you absofuckinglutely should be collectively cringing now. I was also aghast that a conviction for indecent exposure doesn’t mean you’re banned from the police. You’d be banned from a responsible role in the City for that, and look at the power and influence the police wield. They need to do better.

He was accused, but not convicted.

Mr L looks worried when the news is on as I regularly yell at him ‘see! More men creating shit in this world!’

I have done a lot of ranting about male violence today.

At Pilates, one of the women said her daughter’s school had brought in this super-head who is clamping down on discipline & teaching all the kids to look teachers in the eye, etc. And it just made me angry that they think that’s ok. It’s that sort of unquestioning do what grown ups tell you attitude that leads you into situations where all your instincts are screaming “this is not ok”. Anyway, it’s kind of unrelated but made me angrier.

Lily wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 9:55 pm How the case was pieced together is testament to the huge amount of work done by those investigating. It is incredible.

Yes but also all the CCTV footage speaks to the sheer arrogance, entitlement and exceptionalism of him. I often watch those investigative documentaries where I'm amazed at how, through sheer thickness and Ignorance, crims leave behind a trail of CCTV, ANPR and physical evidence.

This fuckshit hired a car in person, he filled a fucking jerry can at a petrol station (before it was a national pastime) - camera central if ever there was one. He really must have felt he was untouchable.

I can totally see how that would piss you off, Pip. It's the lack of nuance and understanding.

Ella77 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 9:02 pm Or is simply much, much stronger.

Yes, I keep thinking this. He had his plan to get her to come quietly, but who knows what he would’ve done if she had put up any kind of resistance. Which is not to say I think anyone is victim blaming (here especially) but I’m trying not to dwell on it as the lynchpin of this being either a murder or a narrow escape. To Rebs’ point, he had no issue hiring a car in his own name, “arresting” her in view of passing cars and buses and so on - he may have just strong-armed her into the car even if she had tried the reassuring tactics mentioned here and elsewhere about asking to be escorted to a station, taking pictures of warrant card etc.

Her mum’s heartbreaking point about not being able to see her face again because of how he disposed of the body is the thing that keeps coming back to me. I hadn’t even considered the horror of that being taken away from them on top of everything else.

Rebel Pebble wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 9:49 pm

Mountain Goat wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 9:42 pm I am also so fucking sick of the men muscling in on this with all the not all men and men get murdered too bullshit. Sit down, shut up, listen. I am verging on full Falling Down.

That's now been joined with "not all male police officers".

A police officer replied to me on Twitter saying something along the lines of "there's 100k officers and just a few bad apples" I said the problem is how to tell who they are when they have such power over you.

I see the Met have now said they won't send undercover patrols out on their own any more, there will always be two or more. Let's hope two bad apples don't find each other over a WhatsApp account then.

I hope Way.ne lives a very, very long life.

I was brought up in a family/community where the police weren't trusted but I'd probably still have got into that car. It's utterly heartbreaking, her poor family.

I have no idea how Cressida Dick is still in a job, she has presided over a number of terrible incidents but she still seems untouchable.

They must investigate Cousins, there's no way this is a first offence. You don't suddenly become a murderer in your late 40s.

Course not. 'Ooh gosh think I might do me some a-murdering today'. There's a trail of destruction right behind this.

sally maclennane wrote: ↑Fri Oct 01, 2021 8:36 am
I have no idea how Cressida Dick is still in a job, she has presided over a number of terrible incidents but she still seems untouchable.

Funny how Cressida Dick was given a new two-year contract just BEFORE the Couzens verdict, sentence and subsequent calls for her head. A cynic might say all parties knew what was coming and insulated her with a hefty two-year pay-off.

Rebel Pebble wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 10:23 pm

Lily wrote: ↑Thu Sep 30, 2021 9:55 pm How the case was pieced together is testament to the huge amount of work done by those investigating. It is incredible.

Yes but also all the CCTV footage speaks to the sheer arrogance, entitlement and exceptionalism of him. I often watch those investigative documentaries where I'm amazed at how, through sheer thickness and Ignorance, crims leave behind a trail of CCTV, ANPR and physical evidence.

Very true.

I'd had no idea it was so carefully planned. As you say Smal, he's been building up to this for years.

What got me from the CCTV is that she was surrounded by buildings with lights on. Cars were driving past. She must have felt safe.

Pip, what did the teacher mean about looking teachers in the eye? Sorry, I don't get what that was about.

The Met has told LBC that women should “run away” if confronted by a lone officer. Most women can’t outrun a guy police officer, and it sounds like a good way to be tasered or accused of resisting arrest.

How can they instil confidence if their advice is to run away? How about they do something about the predators and offenders who are still in their ranks?

https://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presenters/ ... e-warrant/

Its a minor issue really but who the fuck is managing the Met's PR? It's an absolute shambles. It's like How Not to Manage Media 101!

Run away? Seriously?

They did also suggest flagging down a bus. Which would be handy if your assault happened at 53 minutes past the hour, and the driver was especially keen to pick up people who were apparently criminals mid arrest.

I am furious with everything being turned back on us. This is what to do if a policeman assaults you, not this is what we're going to do to ensure no policeman ever assaults a woman again. Or minimised. Oh, it's so rare! Most men are so kind! Don't worry little girl, you'll be ok. Oh fuck off.

Mountain Goat wrote: ↑Fri Oct 01, 2021 11:32 am They did also suggest flagging down a bus. Which would be handy if your assault happened at 53 minutes past the hour, and the driver was especially keen to pick up people who were apparently criminals mid arrest.

I am furious with everything being turned back on us. This is what to do if a policeman assaults you, not this is what we're going to do to ensure no policeman ever assaults a woman again. Or minimised. Oh, it's so rare! Most men are so kind! Don't worry little girl, you'll be ok. Oh fuck off.

Yep, and yep.

Flag down a bus. What the...?

As someone said on twitter, has someone told the bus companies they they are now a new emergency service? And what completely urban-centric advice too