Questions for childcare providers

[Kenickie]

I'm trying to sort childcare for Topsy and Tim. I'm a bit more drawn towards a childminder because I think they'd like a home setting as they're still quite little and especially because they haven't really seen anyone for the last year so I think nursery might be a bit overwhelming at first. I guess nursery is better for the social side of things but I'm not sure that matters until they're a year or so older and then we might add in a very local pre school. But realistically I think it's going to be nursery as it seems impossible to get a childminder with two spaces!

I've got a chat with one potential childminder who doesn't have full-time spaces but we might be able to make work tomorrow, and then next week I have a zoom tour of a nursery and another one I'm going to go and peek in at the windows.

I've discounted a couple of childminders (who may not have had spaces anyway) for not entirely rational reasons, one because it's a man (I guess this is really prejudiced and I wouldn't be bothered at all by male nursery staff but a childminder feels different somehow and he's only been doing it for a year) and another because she's got a dog (I guess in some ways this would be great as Topsy and Tim love dogs but I just feel it's a worry for me). I don't know if it's better to go with your gut on this type of stuff or if I should get over myself?

Anyway, what sort of questions would you ask either a nursery or a childminder? Beatrix has already suggested asking about time spent outside and food. I guess knowing their policies for late pick ups would be good too. I was also planning to ask about their attitude to discipline.

[smalex]

Holiday arrangements, childcare vouchers, free hours arrangements (for when they're a little older)?
For childminders I'd ask if they (in ordinary times) do activities with larger groups?(Ws childminder did a forest school with another childminding group and went to a playgroup which was a good compromise between home environment and socialisation, although he went to preschool too)

[wendy james]

It’s so long ago that I don’t really remember so I asked P if he could remember, and all he could come up with was “ask them how they handle a child falling down the toilet”, which isn’t much use to you. It amused us though and Sproglette has stomped off because she’s tired of hearing about the time she fell down the toilet at the childminder.

ANYWAY. I was only really posting to wish you luck! Our childminder had been doing it for ages and probably led us more.

[Cerise]

I’d go with Beatrix’s questions and maybe also group sizes. If a childminder, do they use other groups for socialising. Like will they take them to groups or trips and how is the cost covered.

You are likely to be fined for late pick up.

I want to know more about your discipline question please.

[smalex]

Ask if they'll potty train for you

[Glint]

If you're thinking about a childminder, and planning on staying with them for ages, check what school/ nursery (preschool?) they do drop offs and collections for. How many other children and ages they'd be with - i used to see childminders do the weekly shop with a couple of mindees in tow.

Also, what happens if they (CM) is ill for a day / week / longer - what is their cover position, and also how ill your child would need to be for them to refuse to take them , and if Topsy-turvy was under the weather, would that also mean Tim couldn't attend?

[Morganna]

All of the things you've mentioned, and also what is their holiday policy. A friend of mine was a childminder when J&S were small, and used to take off all the (summer) school holidays and charge a retainer, which I thought was most unfair. Her clients had to find (and pay for) alternative cover for six weeks as well as pay her for holding the place open. That would be even more costly with two.

I think attitudes to what happens if you/they/T and or T are sick is important too - particularly if the minder has children of her own. I don't want to poke a hornets' nest here, so will just say that it is important that you have similar attitudes about it. You don't want to be constantly having to find emergency care because one of her children has sneezed (or yours sent home for the same reason), or because she takes to her bed at the drop of a hat, and equally you don't want to be sending yours into a plague house, so it might be wise to get things straight from the start.*

Might food be an issue? What is her policy about persuading children to eat when they don't want to (or foods they just don't fancy that day)? Does she offer alternatives or take a harder line? Obviously you will have your own ideas about this, and it's important that they are in line with hers.

*It has occurred to me that Covid will have impacted on this. It's still important to have a policy in place, though.

[Princess Morripov]

(Pre-covid) I felt really strongly that I wanted Tupac to go to a childminder rather than nursery because he’d get to go out and about more, socialise with lots of different groups of children and that would work really well for us. In our village all the childminders hang out together anyway so they’d all go to the zoo/playgroup/park together and have similar routines.

Downsides: if your childminder is ill, or wants time off, you have to arrange the cover/take time off yourself. My childminder didn’t provide food either so I had to make pack breakfast/lunch/dinner to send every day. Eventually my CM became quite unreliable due to health issues and also being a bit of a bellend about quite a few things so I decided it was best to look elsewhere.

Tupac and Biggie now go to nursery full time and it was the absolute best decisions for us all. It’s massively more reliable (even in these uncertain times!) and my original concerns about them being in the same place all day are actually a load of pish as they will need to get used to that routine at school anyway so it sets them in good stead really. The nursery they are at is small but really fantastic - brilliant food menu/variety, loads of different activities, we get an individual daily report sent home detailing what they’ve eaten and activities undertaken etc and obvs loads of lovely crafts

Biggie started in September and at that point he really had very minimal of any other humans but he was fine (traitor) but they were so brill at just making sure he was fine and letting me know how he was settling in.

It’s weird because I’ve never set foot in the place as I registered them both in March last year to start in Sept and I’ve never been able to go in.

Definitely look at settling in sessions - both my chaps had many staggered over a few weeks to get them used to nursery/childminder.

Generally if your child is sick/on holiday you pay anyway and if the nursery is shut (or if it’s a CM and they are sick/ill you wouldn’t pay).

So definitely ask about food provision, opening hours (everywhere here is 8am which is annoying as 7.30am would be loads easier!), set opening and closing periods (eg for holidays or Easter/Christmas)

[Kenickie]

I love that Sproglette fell down the toilet. on that subject, outsourcing potty training would be amazing.

Sickness/holidays are a good point, as are classes/activities if we go for a childminder. And school pick ups and if they do the government free hours/tax free stuff.

Food is an interesting one, I definitely wouldn't want anyone who would try and make them eat stuff. Also Tim has a weird thing sometimes where he hands stuff back to you if he thinks it's not cut up small enough so I guess I want someone who's patient enough to sort him out rather than just assume he's not hungry.

I want to know more about your discipline question please.

Is this not a standard question to ask? I guess I was thinking along the lines of what would they do when they misbehave, what they would see as misbehaving etc. We currently have a lot of fighting, and some biting etc so I'd want to know what they'd do, and how they'd help them deal with their emotions when they're frustrated about not having a toy the other has or not being allowed to do something etc.

[wendy james]

You’ve reminded me that our childminder had an activity on the day we used her, so we had to sign Sproglette up and pay for it! Definitely check that.

[Kenickie]

Oh cross posted. God, having to pack all their food would be a risk nightmare, I can't believe someone would expect that. Presumably you can't just send them with a loaf and a couple of tins of beans either?!

That's reassuring about Biggie getting on so well.

[smalex]

A childminder suited my circumstances with work and was an infill around W going to a local preschool and it was a good experience, but I'd agree a nursery is a lot more reliable, and the variety of activitiesis probablybigger. You hear of more falling out with a CM than nursery, I reckon.

[Leap]

I think the only other thing I might add is to ask if they have a social media or online portal for updates and pictures, just as most of them seem to now. Ours have both so it was good to check how secure they are and what they’re for. The fb is private and for confirmed parents only, and includes general updates like menu changes or upcoming events, and also pictures throughout the day (only including your child if you sign the form agreeing to it). The online portal is just for your child, for the key worker to update specifically on Hop and what she’s been up to that day, and we LOVE it, predictably.

They also give us a slip away every day with a note of what she’s eaten, how much, what activities she participated in and how many nappy changes etc. This is especially good as pick up is so brief with all the restrictions, and really helped me in the beginning not to feel the disconnection Beatrix mentioned about not knowing what she’s been up to for whole days away from us.

[Morganna]

I can't imagine many people would force them to eat . I was thinking more of offering ice cream and cake if they don't fancy their lunch - that sort of thing. S was a really picky eater, and I didn't expect the minder to pander to her whims, but I wanted to know that she's had something to eat. I knew that if treats had been on offer she would have gone for them every time though, so we agreed that she could replace her lunch with something I had provided (spaghetti hoops was one thing I remember being on the reserve list).

It did get easier when they went to nursery, as others have said - much more reliable, and policies for every single eventuality, so everyone knew where they were. It is very easy to overlook something that becomes important later (the holiday retainer caused no end of hassle when parents realised how it worked, for instance).

[Angus]

Mungus went to nursery from 11 months, the baby rooms are quite small so it wasn't overwhelming (for him)

I discounted a CM because my colleague was constantly having to take her holidays when the CM did and I felt it would be too inconvenient.

I totally went with gut feel; they were actually in special measures at the time because they'd let a drunk exhusband take a child he wasn't supposed to. But they were fantastic with Mungus and I don't regret it at all. Obviously I do look back and wonder wtf I was thinking though.

[Jupiter]

We did both. A went to a CM at 11 months when I went back to work. I wanted the home from home setting for her so didn't consider a creche. It was great for her and the CM's family adored her. I don't remember any particular issues with the CM being sick but we did take holidays when she did. I moved her to pre-school when she was two and a half as I felt she needed to be around children her own age and the CM's children were older than her.

When I went back to work when E jnr was eleven months we put him in the same creche where A was doing afterschool club as it made sense logistically. I was concerned he would be overwhelmed and it took longer for him to settle but it's been good for him and the things he learned being around other babies and toddlers was very different to A at the same age.

There are pros and cons to both really depending on what you feel more strongly about.

[Kenickie]

Thanks all this is really useful.

I had my chat with the potential childminder this afternoon. She's been doing it for thirty years, since her children were young and she now minds her two year old grandson (she emphasised though that she's not old and still runs round after her minders ). She's only a couple of miles away so would be super convenient and has looked after loads of people in my village, and is part of a little network of four other childminders so all the mindees get to spend a lot of time together and she says they spend most days outdoors at the local arboretum, national trust places etc.

The only possible downsides are that she sounds like she's got quite definite ways to do things (she brought up potty training and was like 'I don't use pottys, it's much better to just get them to use the toilet from the beginning with their own seat') but as long as it's things I don't care about then it might actually be a plus not to have to make decisions about how to tackle things. And she provides all meals (because she said when she's had people bringing their own food it just causes issues with children wanting what another child has which would definitely happen with mine) but she charges £2.50 a meal which sounds a bit extortionate!

I'm meeting her and her grandson in a park with Topsy and Tim Wednesday so it will be interesting to see what she's like with them and to ask about the details with holidays, sickness etc but it seems like a good possibility. I'm seeing a couple of nurseries this week too.

[Kenickie]

This is proving very frustrating!

I saw both childminders, and they were both a no go. The one who minds her grandson seemed ok but quite inflexible - I asked about naps and what routine she'd do - I don't mind them changing things but I do want something constant. She was just like 'well, I will have other children, so they'll just have to nap whenever, I can't guarantee I'll be home at a set time, don't they just nap in a buggy?' and 'grandson will just nap whenever I put him down, won't they do that?'. Which seemed very unhelpful - particularly if her grandson is so flexible, why not arrange things around Topsy and Tim? And surely it's not too difficult to go out for a morning, come home for a nap and do something in the afternoon? She was also a bit evasive about my questions - I asked what she'd do about biting and she was like 'hmmm, what would YOU do?' which was a bit odd as surely it's not a totally strange question to ask a potential childcare provider (all the nurseries have answered without batting an eyelid)! She also does school pickups and so it felt like Topsy and Tim would be spending part of each day driving around for that which isn't really that fun for them when I'm paying a lot of money for them to be looked after.

The second childminder was really lovely as a person, and gave much better answers about how they'd arrange nap times etc, and really gave the impression that she'd be great with them and much more flexible. However, I went to her house and the minute I walked in I knew it was a no. You went straight in from the front door and there was a really small room (less than half the size of my living room) which had five kids sitting around in it looking really bored, with just a couple of toys, and a teenage boy with them (apparently it was her son who does lunch cover for her proper assistant). The room opened straight on to the kitchen which was gated off, with one baby hanging onto the gate looking in miserably, and they had two dogs running around the kitchen (who jumped all over me when I went through to see the garden). Seeing the environment they were in really swung me towards nursery - I think a good childminder would be great (my mum was one for several years and was fab), but it felt like they'd be going to a home environment that wasn't as nice as their actual home with their actual parents, so they may as well go into a totally different situation (ie nursery) that has its own positives and negatives.

I've found one nursery which is the closest to us and also a local friend has children there and really recommends it. But they might only have 4 days a week in Sept and it's possible we'd need 5 (I still haven't finalised my job situ as I'm seeing if I can do a permanent 4 day week in the local one). However, there's one that's just a little further which I've heard amazing things about and I always thought would be brilliant as it's in my local zoo. So I checked they have space in the zoo one - they only have it from Sept but hopefully we can juggle things until then, so signed them up, paid £100 deposit, and I've just had an email to say that we're on a list to be allocated spaces and will know in a month or so! So I'm a bit pissed off because when I emailed them they said 'yes we have space, register them to confirm it' and now it seems they might not? If they don't have space, they better give me a refund at least! And it seems annoying to have to wait several weeks for them to process everyone's applications.

[F'Artiste]

That’s awful that they’ve asked for a deposit without confirming an actual space. Will you ring to complain?

[lorri_b]

Yeah I wouldn't have been happy with those childminder set ups either. Is that the only nursery available? I think it helps to see a few as they vary so much.