The Mock Turtle

You have cockroaches everywhere?

When I was small I asked my mum why in books (I think it was Puddle Lane) they said "he" rather than "he or she". I don't think they (whoever they are) do that so much now, fortunately.

I was trying to think of something specific I don't like, and I agree with "writing in dialect". FFS, make it readable or don't bother.

Wolf Hall, etc. were written thus because we have very little idea of what Cromwell sounded like. His staff destroyed most of his papers in an attempt to save him, so Hilary Mantel writes as an observer of Cromwell rather than a biographer if that makes any sense. (I read this in the biography of him I'm on) Basically "he" is always Cromwell. Unless he's not.

I found that really difficult at first when reading Hilary Mantel, it was all he said, she said. I thought I was being a right thicko.

When there's really detailed descriptions of anything structural, like a house or hotel. "there was a turning staircase leading to a gallery off which two corridors ran north and south with a door in the west corner to another smaller staircase above which an oriel window..... " I'm already fucking lost. I just can't picture it.

I don't read children's books, obviously, but I'm horrified that the male default is still so prevalent.

Rebel Pebble wrote: ↑Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:49 pm When there's really detailed descriptions of anything structural, like a house or hotel. "there was a turning staircase leading to a gallery off which two corridors ran north and south with a door in the west corner to another smaller staircase above which an oriel window..... " I'm already fucking lost. I just can't picture it.

Yes! this is so accurate.

Honestly, I hate most things in most books like the uncultured oaf I am . Most especially overly descriptive crap. I tried reading the hobbit once and gave up after about a page and a half because it was still describing Bilbo's door knob or something.

Squirrel wrote: ↑Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:59 pm

Rebel Pebble wrote: ↑Thu Sep 17, 2020 9:49 pm When there's really detailed descriptions of anything structural, like a house or hotel. "there was a turning staircase leading to a gallery off which two corridors ran north and south with a door in the west corner to another smaller staircase above which an oriel window..... " I'm already fucking lost. I just can't picture it.

Yes! this is so accurate.

Absolutely Maybe this is one of those things about whether you literally or figuratively visualise things in your head.

I can’t follow things like that either

Lola wrote: ↑Fri Sep 18, 2020 8:45 am I can’t follow things like that either

Me neither

I like to picture interiors and houses generally when I am reading but if it doesn't match the already prepared image I have in my head, I discard the authors vision.

Turtle Bean wrote: ↑Fri Sep 18, 2020 3:52 pm I like to picture interiors and houses generally when I am reading but if it doesn't match the already prepared image I have in my head, I discard the authors vision.

I do this too! Also with people. I have my own image of them in my head and often it has no relation to the physical appearance the author might describe.

I seem to be more tolerant of books than I am of people

I'm reading Troubled Blood just now, the Robert Galbraith/JKR latest. There's a character who is apparently Glaswegian but uses "ken" for know I've lived in Glasgow all my life and nobody ever uses "ken" for know, except when taking the piss out of east coasters. You can tell JKR lives in Edinburgh!

Even I know it’s not a Glasgow thing. Her Cockney is upsetting too.

But she did Skegness geography well.

I have also just finished Troubled Blood and agree about the poetry thing, I just skip it as I can’t see how it relates or what’s the point?

She also does lots of accent writing which can be hard to read.

I also hate really descriptive details and tend to skip over it, but my biggest bugbear is in YA fiction, where they make the characters 16 years in age, but then make them behave and think in ways that are so much older. I always age the characters up in my head to at least 20 - it’s like the author has never been a 16 year old, and certainly hasn’t met one recently!

I saw something recently, about tv where it's even worse, rather than books, wondering why they just don't set the stories in university / college rather than having 15/16 year old characters played by 25 year olds, having sex, going out, working and generally being way more adult than they actually would be.

I’ve thought the opposite about YA before - I think it was Hunger Games where I thought it was really far fetched that these young, fit and doomed youths staying in a hotel before going to their deaths wouldn’t all be shagging

The poetry has reminded me that I can’t stand books within books, especially when a character talks about some highly acclaimed piece of writing they’ve accomplished, and then quotes from it I’ve read Misery a million times but I don’t think ever made it through the drudge of the bee story that goes on for ages and is eventually reproduced with the scribbled letters in it if I remember correctly. I’m sure it’s filled with important symbolism and imagery that reflects Paul Sheldon’s mind and feelings about Annie blah blah I don’t care - it’s just another kind of dream sequence I’m just not interested in.

Agreed on dialect. We had to read Huckleberry Finn for O level, and I virtually had to translate phonetically it before I could read it (and I still hated it - it was a very strange choice for 14 year olds).

The only author (or the only one I can think of) who can write in dialect that I can be bothered with is Roddy Doyle, and he does it so well that I'm almost speaking in a Dublin accent when I'm reading his books. He can also write female characters very convincingly, I find.

I didn't know that about Edinburgh Vs Glasgow.

I tell you what's driving me mad about Troubled Blood. It's policeman this, policeman that every five sentences. IT'S 2020 JUST SAY POLICE OFFICER.

Also the fact that as per usual it's ten times longer than it needs to be. I get that Robin needs new perfume ok!